Let's Talk About Lex
I wanted to address this last week, but some much other stuff came up so here goes (and please remember, these are fictional comic book characters we're talking about people): I agree that Dr. Doom should not be crying about 9-11 considering everything he's done to Marvel Comics New York, but to call him wussier than Lex Luthor is just so wrong.
Let me just put this out here as well before I continue: Superman is not my favorite comic book hero. No character has been jerked around as much as him, and by that I mean the treatment of his powers. One day he's practically a god, the next day missiles, lasers, and well placed punches from questionable adversaries are knocking him aside. I always thought he was best portrayed as the ultimate switchblade superhero, because he has so many powers; in reality he's only limited by his imagination (or rather, that of the writers). And don't get me started on the "stories that deal with him being an outsider" thing; gee, wonder where that idea came from? Personally, I rank Batman and Spider-Man a level higher than the Man of Steel.
Anyway, it's always tempting to compare Marvel characters with DC ones, especially when both comic companies have that nasty habit if stealing from each other. But is one is to make comparisons on such characters, you can't just use one medium. Dr. Doom and Lex Luther have each been in movies and animated shows in their lifetimes, so the theory that "Lex Luther has balls" needs further examination.
First let's look at Lex in films. In the early Superman movies, he's little more than a immoral real estate agent. I don't remember him being aggressive towards Superman at all; in fact, if I recall correctly, in Superman II he spent most of the time kissing either Superman's ass or General Zod's.
In the most recent one, he has the title of "criminal mastermind," but admitted (in passing to his girl) that he needed the thugs he surrounded himself with for protection in prison. Oh, and he only fought Superman after the big guy landed on a landmass comprised of Kryptonite. Sounds tough to me.
In the 80's Superfriends, he was leader of the Legion of Doom, which was a joke of a group. So much so, that as the series continued, Lex took a backseat to Darkseid.
On the TV show Smallville: Lex flirts with Clark Kent, falls in love with Lana Lang, and has more daddy issues than a Steven Spielberg movie. Seriously, Lionel Luther makes any incarnation of Lex (with the possible exception of Kevin Spacey's) look like Jimmy Olsen having a bad day.
In the Bruce Timm Universe (aka, Justice League circa 2002), Lex was arguably at his best: deceptive, manipulative, power-hungry and cruel. I mean totally hardcore evil. His line at the end of the first Superman ep, where he claims that 1/3rd of Metropolis works for him whether they know it or not and that there's not a damn thing Supes can do about it, was classic. This Lex didn't bring together a group of villains to capture or annoy the Justice League/Superfriends, he wanted to kill them. But then, he ruined it in the ep Hereafter where he said to a grieving Lois Lane that he'd miss Superman too.
WTF?!?
I'm sorry, but Lex Luthor is not exempt from moments of wimpiness. I'm calling a foul. Now if people just want to argue in the context of the comics, fine. But when character is discussed, remember that there's more than the comics to look at.
And for the record: Marvel's Apocalypse is the most hardcore (and consistent) villain of the two comic companies, with Darkseid coming in a distant second (he loses major points for being Wonder Woman's bitch in the Superfriends cartoon).
Let me just put this out here as well before I continue: Superman is not my favorite comic book hero. No character has been jerked around as much as him, and by that I mean the treatment of his powers. One day he's practically a god, the next day missiles, lasers, and well placed punches from questionable adversaries are knocking him aside. I always thought he was best portrayed as the ultimate switchblade superhero, because he has so many powers; in reality he's only limited by his imagination (or rather, that of the writers). And don't get me started on the "stories that deal with him being an outsider" thing; gee, wonder where that idea came from? Personally, I rank Batman and Spider-Man a level higher than the Man of Steel.
Anyway, it's always tempting to compare Marvel characters with DC ones, especially when both comic companies have that nasty habit if stealing from each other. But is one is to make comparisons on such characters, you can't just use one medium. Dr. Doom and Lex Luther have each been in movies and animated shows in their lifetimes, so the theory that "Lex Luther has balls" needs further examination.
First let's look at Lex in films. In the early Superman movies, he's little more than a immoral real estate agent. I don't remember him being aggressive towards Superman at all; in fact, if I recall correctly, in Superman II he spent most of the time kissing either Superman's ass or General Zod's.
In the most recent one, he has the title of "criminal mastermind," but admitted (in passing to his girl) that he needed the thugs he surrounded himself with for protection in prison. Oh, and he only fought Superman after the big guy landed on a landmass comprised of Kryptonite. Sounds tough to me.
In the 80's Superfriends, he was leader of the Legion of Doom, which was a joke of a group. So much so, that as the series continued, Lex took a backseat to Darkseid.
On the TV show Smallville: Lex flirts with Clark Kent, falls in love with Lana Lang, and has more daddy issues than a Steven Spielberg movie. Seriously, Lionel Luther makes any incarnation of Lex (with the possible exception of Kevin Spacey's) look like Jimmy Olsen having a bad day.
In the Bruce Timm Universe (aka, Justice League circa 2002), Lex was arguably at his best: deceptive, manipulative, power-hungry and cruel. I mean totally hardcore evil. His line at the end of the first Superman ep, where he claims that 1/3rd of Metropolis works for him whether they know it or not and that there's not a damn thing Supes can do about it, was classic. This Lex didn't bring together a group of villains to capture or annoy the Justice League/Superfriends, he wanted to kill them. But then, he ruined it in the ep Hereafter where he said to a grieving Lois Lane that he'd miss Superman too.
WTF?!?
I'm sorry, but Lex Luthor is not exempt from moments of wimpiness. I'm calling a foul. Now if people just want to argue in the context of the comics, fine. But when character is discussed, remember that there's more than the comics to look at.
And for the record: Marvel's Apocalypse is the most hardcore (and consistent) villain of the two comic companies, with Darkseid coming in a distant second (he loses major points for being Wonder Woman's bitch in the Superfriends cartoon).
Comments
You're also conveniently using only the tv/movie characterizations of Luthor when the only honest comparison is comic to comic because there's only one real portrayal of Doom in the movies and he kind of sucks compared to the movie Luthor (who, in the first Superman launched two nukes at the west coast, then engineered a takeover of the White House in Superman 2, then in Superman Returns thought nothing of murdering millions to form his own continent).
I'll admit that my impression of Superman is skewed by things like SuperDickery.com, the show Smallville, and the fact that I thought that (as good an actor that Gene Hackman was) the Lex in the first Superman Movie was miscast. I will concede that Superman has a richer history than Spidey or Bats but I still believe the other two resonate with people better. Bats and Spidey represent the type of hero a person could be where Superman is pure wish fulfillment.
Doom has been portrayed in cartoons before, but most people either haven't watched as many cartoons as I have, so I deicided to exclude his brief appearances in the 90's Spider-Man cartoon or in the recent Fantastic Four cartoon. Besides, the post was about Lex.
I'll also admit Doom has been weak in the movies (I blame Tim Story for that more than anything), but at least Doom was actively trying to kill his enemies; in the movies Lex seems to consider Superman as more of an annoyance than a rival.
Personally, I'd say Spacey's Lex and the guy who played (adult) Lex in the short-lived "Superboy" live TV show in the early 90's have been the best portrayals thus far.